Electrobel

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Originally posted by : Numtek

this is why all my music is CC'ed. As a fact : the ripped track is also filed under CC, because that is a requirement to be hosted ion scene.org. I've also got some animations demos, tracks, still frames and such on that server.

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by tempestflt on 1/12/07
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I came here to clear up some things...

Seems like many of the people writing here didn't even bother to listen closely to 'Acidjazzed Evening' (referred as AE from now on) and 'Do It' (referred is DI from now on), or are just plain tonedeaf. Maybe it would help if I'd explain what
those songs have and don't have in common. Grab your headphones, because they really help spotting the stuff
in DI that got sampled!

First: the basis of the song DI is the intro from AE. If you want to spot the similarities, then don't listen AE longer than
15 seconds, which holds 16 bars of music (no, DI is not "quoting" AE - 1-2 seconds would be quoting).
There is not a single part in DI that is not based on these 16 bars. In the chorus of DI, the sampled part is cut into
half and only the first half of it is being used, played over and over till the next verse, when the whole sample is
being played again.

AE repeats it's intro-theme at some point, but mainly it goes to another directions. If you have hard time finding the
resemblance between AE and DI, then don't listen AE for more than 15 seconds. This is crucial.

What was sampled?
For DI someone sampled the intro of GRG's C64-version of AE, but with disabling the bass-channel. The bassline was
reconstructed in DI - no, It's not "totally different" than AE's bassline as someone said. It's just a stripped down version, with octave intervals removed (fe. A2-A3 -> A2) and 2-3 notes left out.
There are 6 different chords (of which many are repeated) in AE's intro, jazzy kind of chords that for most I dont even
know their names, but I'll list them here to show that it's not a typical pop-song chord-progression (actually if someone
can find a similar chord-progression, I'll give him a beer or two):
G# C C# F | A# C# F G# | G# C# D# F | F# A# C# F | A# C D# G# | G# C D# F
Each column represents a list of notes used in each chord. It's not the actual chord-progression, but a list of the
6 chords (most popsongs have around 3-4 chords all together) used in the intro, but I think you get the point...

The chords are arpeggiated, which means that the notes in the chord are being played at the same time, but being
rapidly from lowest note to the highest and not at the same time. This is a crucial point for anyone who can
differentiate a clear note from a dog bark and because chords are not usually played like this, unless you're a
superfast heavy metal guitar player, J. C. Bach or a 80s homecomputer-soundchip with only 3 channels available.
But in mainstream pop music? No chance.

The melody? Listen to AE's intro few times and then listen to DI with headphones on. It's all there, playing in
the background. The melody that Nelly sings is kind of a variation of the melody in AE's intro, but the original
melody is also there, in the background of DI! Here's another crucial point; they didn't remove the original melody, but
only lowered down it's volume and placed another melody (which Nelly sings) on top of it. I'd call this counterpoint,
if the the people behind DI wouldn't be such hacks. If you want to verify my claim about the melody, then don't pay
much attention to what Nelly is singing (or the drums) but everything else what is there; bassline,
"background-melody" and the arpeggiated chords.

There you have it. 16 bars of music, a whole verse, which became about 4 verses in the hands of another.

I can't discuss the legal issues here. Let's just say that Big Record Companies are surely the works of The Devil.
Spread the word...

-tempest

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by tempestflt 21 hours ago
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I'll make one more remark and then I'm out:

"First of all you have to prove that Timbaland heard your track before he made his track. "

Acidjazzed Evening competed in Oldschool Music Compo at Assembly 2000 in Helsinki, infront of more than 4000 people (voters) and won the competition. There are good documents on this. You can of course believe that the whole event never took place, but would require heavy dose of self-deluding and not doing your research properly.

And no, I haven't given the copyrights of AE to anyone. Competing with a piece of music/graphics/whatever hardly ever involves giving up the copyright.

And for the one who talked about "similar chordprogression and bpm": did you read my post? There's 16
bars of melody aswell. Take 16 bars from any any memorable theme and see/hear what I mean...

"Why would he steal from you? He would lose credibility and cash."

You'll have to ask him. I know the whole things sounds very impropable... or does it really? Do we really know how often things like these happen? My song was easy to spot, because of the "C64ish" chipsounds I used, but what about songs that use "regular" instruments? And even if record companies pay compensation for the original composer they "borrow" from, they still might earn more from it than they lose. Loose-album has sold 2,5 million copies already and it's not just about the record sales, but also about touring, gaining loads of money by filling big arenas etc. Nelly Furtado is a product.

...and from what I see, Timbaland didn't lose cash but gained cash!

One more notice: I wouldn't recommend Gloom's video, atleast for "skeptics". He misses some key points there, uses bad set of examples - for example he even uses the later variation of the AE's intro's melody and not the actual intromelody. That's why he has to cut it off quicky, because the end of the melody is a bit different from the one that got sampled in DI. I do have to admit that the final demonstration in the video, with both songs played simultaniously, is charming =). The video might work as a good hint, but don't expect it to prove anything. Do your own research/listening. (There's a good set of mp3-examples as torrent, by some unknown individual.)

-tempest

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all tracks on ebel are automatically CC'ed too. i wonder if there are any precedents in lawsuits where CC artists won in this kind of situation. when you're with buma/stemra they handle it for you but if you're CC you have to organize it yourself. i'm curious about what the chances for winning in such a case are then.

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"Jimmy Smith is my man, I'd like to give him a pound"

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Originally posted by : Numtek
Tegenwoordig kan je niet meer vechten tegen grote labels/bedrijven. Ze rekken de rechtzaak 5+ jaar en je gaat bankroet. Ik probeer hier niet de worried warrior uit te hangen, maar als een major label steelt van mijn beats kan ik het ook niet betalen.

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Originally posted by : dtr

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Originally posted by : Numtek
Tegenwoordig kan je niet meer vechten tegen grote labels/bedrijven. Ze rekken de rechtzaak 5+ jaar en je gaat bankroet. Ik probeer hier niet de worried warrior uit te hangen, maar als een major label steelt van mijn beats kan ik het ook niet betalen.

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that's indeed what i'm worried about... probably the only way to have a chance at it is create a fuzz about it in the CC community and try to find financial and organizational support that way. maybe a big precedent with a lot of media coverage would be beneficial...

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Originally posted by : MarinuZz

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Originally posted by : dtr

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Originally posted by : Numtek
Tegenwoordig kan je niet meer vechten tegen grote labels/bedrijven. Ze rekken de rechtzaak 5+ jaar en je gaat bankroet. Ik probeer hier niet de worried warrior uit te hangen, maar als een major label steelt van mijn beats kan ik het ook niet betalen.

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that's indeed what i'm worried about... probably the only way to have a chance at it is create a fuzz about it in the CC community and try to find financial and organizational support that way. maybe a big precedent with a lot of media coverage would be beneficial...

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Is it not possible to get a legal assistance insurance for support. In situations when you have the law of them. When they busting your cc agreement.

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Originally posted by : dtr

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Originally posted by : MarinuZz

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Originally posted by : dtr

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Originally posted by : Numtek
Tegenwoordig kan je niet meer vechten tegen grote labels/bedrijven. Ze rekken de rechtzaak 5+ jaar en je gaat bankroet. Ik probeer hier niet de worried warrior uit te hangen, maar als een major label steelt van mijn beats kan ik het ook niet betalen.

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that's indeed what i'm worried about... probably the only way to have a chance at it is create a fuzz about it in the CC community and try to find financial and organizational support that way. maybe a big precedent with a lot of media coverage would be beneficial...

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Is it not possible to get a legal assistance insurance for support. In situations when you have the law of them. When they busting your cc agreement.

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wablieft? :))

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tempest says
Me giving up (legally) on this issue is just a misquote. I've said couple of times, that I can't discuss about the legal aspects of this issue here.

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Originally posted by : dtr

does that sucker have a sidstation?! makes me feel a whole lot less good about having one myself

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Originally posted by : MarinuZz

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Originally posted by : dtr

does that sucker have a sidstation?! makes me feel a whole lot less good about having one myself

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nintendo sounds!! :) How much cost a sid station. That thing rules.

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Originally posted by : dtr

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Originally posted by : MarinuZz

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Originally posted by : dtr

does that sucker have a sidstation?! makes me feel a whole lot less good about having one myself

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nintendo sounds!! :) How much cost a sid station. That thing rules.

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commodore C64 sound actually ;)

they aren t produced anymore so it's 2nd hand market prices. i bought mine at around 300/400 but i've seen much higher prices since then. there's also DIY kits, hardsid and midibox sid for example.

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